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Post by rmplstlskn on Mar 7, 2015 20:59:20 GMT -5
New to planning a 1~3-day Patrol Pack and would like some ideas, item lists, and must-have gear... I am familiar with "Bug Out Bags (BOB)" and "Get Home Bags (GHB)" and Medic bags, but a PATROL PACK is a much different animal (in my mind). There is some cross-over of gear, but new gear to this mission as well. To my understanding as just an AC with no military experience, the 1~3 day Patrol Pack is for gear that allows for a slow and quiet mission that will often begin and end at ones HOME BASE. So it is NOT a BOB, geared for a possibility that you may never come back home, or a GHB that is geared to provide bare essentials to survive while you walk back home for some reason. It is to support reconnaissance, patrol, and if need be direct action.
I specifically want to focus on the PACK and its contents, not a war belt or chest rig.
Some REQUIRED ITEMS off the top of my head to get it rolling:
SHELTER: - simple SHELTER, like a sil-nylon tarp (camo ideal or earth tone)
- backpackers tent stakes
- paracord (dark color)
- bivy sack??? waterproof tarp to wrap up in??? sleeping bag??? Or just patrol clothing alone? AO dictates gear here? I am not sure how to handle this one...
WATER: - Bladder in pack (in addition to canteens on belt, if pack gets dropped)
- survival straw filter
- backpacking water filter? Is this overboard?
FIRE: - Fire making kit (if patrol environ allows for this, or for emergency heat)
FOOD: - lightweight food (freeze-dried, MRE, other commercial equivalent)
- snacks (to keep engine strong, warm, and fueled while in movement)
- small stove with fuel (use canteen cup from belt kit)
- coffee/tea packs
PERSONAL GEAR: - 1 set of extra CAMO clothing (includes underwear, base layer, extra socks)
- Extra glasses/contacts
- small towel (backpackers towel)
- Camo face paint / small mirror (signal mirror)
- Gloves
- Face netting (bugs/stationary observation)
- bug spray/lotion
PATROL GEAR: - Binoculars / monocular (less ideal)
- handheld radio (patrol comms or base comms, depending on distance) & extra batteries
- handheld GPS
- small shovel? Not sure about this one...
SAFETY GEAR:
What is MISSING? I have to think on this more...
What is in YOUR pack? What is YOUR list?
Rmpl
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Post by Patriotic Sheepdog on Mar 8, 2015 12:02:16 GMT -5
Well, for me a one day pack list is different from a three day. many of the same things but a bit less for one day. Also, the mission, size of patrol and weather will dictate some of the gear as you know.
Shelter: One day-poncho and liner if needed...three day may be-tarp, bivy, ground cloth, Catoma BedNet etc.
Water: One day-bladder and canteen....three day same plus filter system and/or extra canteen(s)
Fire: have two forms of making fire
Food: Same for one and three day, just more for three day
Personal: again same for one or three day, just more for three day. I like personal wipes. This can be baby wipes or cleansing wipes. Can be used for a quick in the field "bath" and used for personal area cleansing. Also some sunscreen.
Patrol gear: depending on how many in the patrol.... Mono/Bino Compass and area topo map (at least one member should have these) NODs Extra med gear (size and gear may depend on medic skills and size of patrol) for a three day where we are likely to have contact, the medic may need to distribute some of his personal gear to accommodate the extra med supplies. Also, each team member may be carrying a 1-liter IV bag with IV set up taped to bag.
Safety: P3 (Personal Pill Pack) each member needs to have one of these Spare compass Weapon cleaning kit Eye and ear pro Extra chem light Flashlight with blue/green/red filter Extra rifle mags, loaded, in a double mag pouch(es) on outside of pack Bump helmet
Just my quick thoughts. Overall you have a good list.
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Post by panzer0170 on Mar 8, 2015 13:03:48 GMT -5
New to planning a 1~3-day Patrol Pack and would like some ideas, item lists, and must-have gear... I am familiar with "Bug Out Bags (BOB)" and "Get Home Bags (GHB)" and Medic bags, but a PATROL PACK is a much different animal (in my mind). There is some cross-over of gear, but new gear to this mission as well. To my understanding as just an AC with no military experience, the 1~3 day Patrol Pack is for gear that allows for a slow and quiet mission that will often begin and end at ones HOME BASE. So it is NOT a BOB, geared for a possibility that you may never come back home, or a GHB that is geared to provide bare essentials to survive while you walk back home for some reason. It is to support reconnaissance, patrol, and if need be direct action. Honestly, each one of those is going to be a different loadout. A fighting patrol (Go find and kill) is different to a standing patrol (Go see what's happening, get eyes out generically over the ground) is different again to a recce patrol. Ammo loadouts are different, time periods and scales a different. WITH THAT SAID, it's important to have a base, so I'll throw in my thoughts.
I specifically want to focus on the PACK and its contents, not a war belt or chest rig.
Some REQUIRED ITEMS off the top of my head to get it rolling:
SHELTER: - simple SHELTER, like a sil-nylon tarp (camo ideal or earth tone) Fuck sil-nylon off. It's strong, but I've yet to find one that you can use to casevac someone if need be.
- backpackers tent stakes Yes. Make sure you have a couple of sets for different ground, or know your AO well enough that you don't need them (treeline) or you're on the same sort of ground wherever you intend to harbour/bivvy.
- paracord (dark color) Pre attached to tarp. If you can get some basha poles, you've got a full shelter that weighs bugger all and works in wooded areas, open areas, anything.
- bivy sack??? waterproof tarp to wrap up in??? sleeping bag??? Or just patrol clothing alone? AO dictates gear here? I am not sure how to handle this one...1 day (assuming a day is 24 hour, not just daytime) Take a bivvy bag. 3 day? You need a sleeping bag. What little sleep you get needs to be of relative quality, otherwise on day three you will be a liability.
WATER: - Bladder in pack (in addition to canteens on belt, if pack gets dropped)
- survival straw filter Sawyer squeeze will fit inline to most bladders. Make sure your bladder is free of particulates and you're good to go straight from the bladder. Done.
- backpacking water filter? Is this overboard?
FIRE: - Fire making kit (if patrol environ allows for this, or for emergency heat) Hexamine is good for this, or whatever the commercial equivalent name is. Solid white stuff that looks like Kendal Mint Cake.
FOOD: - lightweight food (freeze-dried, MRE, other commercial equivalent) Yes. If it's freeze dried remember you'll need to take on more water relative to what you normally would, to counter dehydration.
- snacks (to keep engine strong, warm, and fueled while in movement) Boiled sweets. Haribo. Breakfast bars.
- small stove with fuel (use canteen cup from belt kit) Fuel = Hexi from above. Will square you away. If you want to go for comfort, take gas too.
- coffee/tea packs Brew kit is essential. Without it we'd never have won any wars
PERSONAL GEAR: - 1 set of extra CAMO clothing (includes underwear, base layer, extra socks)Wet dry drills apply here. Dry kit to sleep in, the other set to wear. You need AT LEAST one pair of socks per day. I would advise a pair of goretex socks as well. These are worn OVER normal socks, and are intended to dry out boots. They are not a replacement. Make sure you understand their use if you have them, they can be a curse if you use them wrong.
- Extra glasses/contacts Yup.
- small towel (backpackers towel) Why? If you're going for cleaning, get babywipes. They'll strip cam cream off you, and they do a plenty good job of hygeine, short term. Unscented, naturlich.
- Camo face paint / small mirror (signal mirror)Yep.
- Gloves Fighting pair and a warm pair, AO dependant.
- Face netting (bugs/stationary observation)
- bug spray/lotion Cam cream should have this. If you cam up properly you should be bug-free, too
PATROL GEAR: - Binoculars / monocular (less ideal) Unless you are operating in super open terrain, a rifle scope tends to do the job here. Certainly in place of binos.
- handheld radio (patrol comms or base comms, depending on distance) & extra batteries
- handheld GPS Maps. Compass. (You might include that in your fighting gear, but I'd include the GPS in there too, so just making sure...)
- small shovel? Not sure about this one... Yes. Yes. Yes. Shit in a hole, away from water.
SAFETY GEAR: - FAK Dioralyte is a fucking GEM. Supposed to be for diahorrea but if you're sweating a shit ton and drinking pure water but not getting MUCH in the way of food, it's good for keeping your electrolytes unfucked.
- Meds Aches and pains. Grazes. Infections. COMPEED FOR YOUR FEET.
- Multi-tool/knife Mora Clipper = Cheap as chips and bloody decent for all you'll need it for.
What is MISSING? I have to think on this more...
What is in YOUR pack? What is YOUR list?
Rmpl
A decent list, I'm assuming a lot of the stuff you're not including is on a list of fighting gear (Like, say, a rifle and all your ammo )
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Post by Hawkeye on Mar 8, 2015 13:28:58 GMT -5
I'll weigh in when I have a chance, and I'm sure Diz can offer some thoughts/suggestions when he has time. I did want to say though, the responses you got on your thread you posted at a certain other place, are exactly why we started this forum.
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currahee
New Member
"Stands Alone"
Posts: 151
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Post by currahee on Mar 8, 2015 16:39:16 GMT -5
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Post by rmplstlskn on Mar 9, 2015 7:57:55 GMT -5
I'll weigh in when I have a chance, and I'm sure Diz can offer some thoughts/suggestions when he has time. I did want to say though, the responses you got on your thread you posted at a certain other place, are exactly why we started this forum. Never really saw the cluelessness until that post and some of the responses...
I am far from being a snake-eater, far from being lean & mean, so I am under no allusions that life will ~not~ suck if "something" happens... But my god man, one has to see the need for ~short-term patrols~ of your area to know what is going on BEFORE it gets to your front door. And SKILL, camo & gear is the obvious ingredients for success and survival, plus LUCK/GRACE.
To carry a BOB in this scenario is stupid... To carry nothing but a folding knife, gun & ammo in cotton clothes is even worse....
But I wasn't shocked, and I have thick online skin...
Sadly, I suspect some of those "tactical operators" will be the armed looters one day...
Rmpl
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Post by Hawkeye on Mar 9, 2015 8:37:00 GMT -5
That's exactly who they'll be.
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Post by rmplstlskn on Mar 9, 2015 8:59:29 GMT -5
Honestly, each one of those is going to be a different loadout. A fighting patrol (Go find and kill) is different to a standing patrol (Go see what's happening, get eyes out generically over the ground) is different again to a recce patrol. Ammo loadouts are different, time periods and scales a different. Yes, I see your point...
A thought on a solution for a non-taxpayer supported citizen soldier (limited funds), if time allows...
At this point, I cannot afford to have multiple packs, belts, chest rigs and gear purpose built for many possible scenarios. That would be a lot of gear that would require several of EACH item, for each kit...
So maybe a pre-printed LIST of gear load out for various scenarios and the gear all stored in one general area. You start with a bag & web gear that is designed around a "most likely scenario" (like a standing patrol), then you load out according to the need using the lists so as to not forget something (which WILL happen under stress and fog of the scenario). This is nowhere near as fast as having purpose-built gear ready to go for several different scenarios, but if one has time, a bag and web gear could be changed around fairly quickly. Worst case, if you have to grab and run (not a bug out) to investigate and respond to something quickly, you have a decent load out ready to go built to your "most likely event" list...
These lists would be checklists... You collect the gear in the list in one spot, then load your bag & web gear. After, you are ready to go...
Right now I have only TWO "military-grade" backpacks... One a big BOB bag that is designed around a scenario that my wife, daughter, and I have to flee our home ON FOOT. Since I will be carrying most of the gear to "support life" for 3 family members (cooking, food, water, shelter, etc...), this bag is heavy and not nimble on the back. It is designed to truly make life as UN-SUCK as possible for being in the woods, on foot, and we may never come back home again... It is designed for slow going with many stops to give my back & feet a break, but to provide the stuff needed to survive without utter misery and wishing death instead... Add in weapon & ammo, it will not be a FUN event... It is for a REAL SHTF event... (Did I mention I pray every day that if "something happens" that I can BUG IN at home ideally, or load up the RV trailer and DRIVE AWAY.... LOL!)
The second pack is a non-frame, 3-day "assault pack" (see other thread on assault pack for pics) that will work with a war belt and chest rig. This is the gear that most of my "most likely scenarios" will be built upon. This is the pack that will be load swapped per the needs of the moment. So it will be minimalist with only a few luxuries, like tarp shelter to keep the rain and dew at bay.
Everything else I own is good-quality commercial backpacking gear we use for normal family outings... It is not as robust, not molle compatible, and without camo, some of it even bright colored... (I buy on clearance, so often I take the colors that are discounted to save $$$ on good quality gear)
So essentially, for the scenarios you listed Panzer, I only have ONE pack, one war belt, and one chest rig (AR-based, hope to order an AK-based rig from UW soon). I would need to make this work for ALL scenarios, less a true bug out...
Rmpl
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Post by panzer0170 on Mar 9, 2015 12:34:45 GMT -5
As a taxpayer SUPPORTED soldier... Same. I could go out for 3 weeks and expect to do all of the above, with one set of gear. All gear for all scenarios (within reason) in your 'house' (bergan) You then carry as little of that as possible to fulfil the role given to you (fighting, standing, recce patrols). A more detailed answer to follow.
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winter
Junior Member
Posts: 479
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Post by winter on Mar 9, 2015 18:40:58 GMT -5
The responses you got on the other site were a mixed bag. Seems that your "masturbatory fantasy" is only happening in 40 countries right fucking now. You have a good list. Drop the extra set of clothes, add more socks, snivel gear, and underwear, and do not under any circumstances eat fucking sunflower seeds on patrol or in the field at all. The worst tracker will easily track sunflower seed eaters. Troops in Vietnam would do 50 day patrols, yes, 50 day, with no change of clothes. Their resupply was water, food, ammo, and medical supplies only. I used a silnylon tarp only because I spent $100 on it and want my moneys worth out of it. Mine is a 10'X12'. A regular 8'x10' tarp is cheap, far more waterproof then silnylon or a poncho liner/basha, but is louder to use. I suggest the larger size because I like my gear and me to be as dry as it can be in the morning. I live in brutal terrain so I kinda slide downhill or migrate in my sleep. It's also a rainforest with high winds so rain is not coming straight down. Sleeping gear in the winter is sleeping bag, sleeping mat, heavy duty survival blanket as a ground cloth, polypro long underwear that is fresh and dry, and the biggest fluffy socks I can find. In the summer (60 deg f +) it's a roughly 10'x16' piece of parachute cloth as a sleeping bag/blanket, the ground cloth and sleeping pad. The parachute was an accidental miracle I discovered. One layer of the giant piece keeps the bugs off, additional layers as you fold it add warmth rapidly and if need be you can put natural material between folds for additional loft that will equate to warmth. Civvy camping, I always have the parachute cloth with me, it's endlessly useful and can be used for everything from twisting it into a heavy duty rope to a windbreak. It will shed water if the angle is greater than 45degrees. The more angle, the better. Every member of a patrol should have an UNMARKED map and a compass. Use map overlays if you must mark anything and make sure the overlay is not simple to determine where to put on the map to reveal its secrets. If your map guy gets blown the fuck up, well, so did the map. Everybody having a map also ensures the capability that each person can find the way home or to the objective even if they are the lone survivor. The multiple loadout issue is an easy one. Keep your bag set up as a 3-5 day but have the gear that extends the trip in a separate ditty bag that straps to the outside of the ruck or replaces your sleeping bag inside the ruck and you strap the fartsack to the outside for the longer trips. ETA- survival essentials like food and water should always be 3-5 days worth.
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Post by panzer0170 on Mar 9, 2015 19:00:12 GMT -5
The responses you got on the other site were a mixed bag. Seems that your "masturbatory fantasy" is only happening in 40 countries right fucking now. You have a good list. Drop the extra set of clothes, add more socks, snivel gear, and underwear, and do not under any circumstances eat fucking sunflower seeds on patrol or in the field at all. The worst tracker will easily track sunflower seed eaters. Troops in Vietnam would do 50 day patrols, yes, 50 day, with no change of clothes. Their resupply was water, food, ammo, and medical supplies only. I used a silnylon tarp only because I spent $100 on it and want my moneys worth out of it. Mine is a 10'X12'. A regular 8'x10' tarp is cheap, far more waterproof then silnylon or a poncho liner/basha, but is louder to use. I suggest the larger size because I like my gear and me to be as dry as it can be in the morning. I live in brutal terrain so I kinda slide downhill or migrate in my sleep. It's also a rainforest with high winds so rain is not coming straight down. Sleeping gear in the winter is sleeping bag, sleeping mat, heavy duty survival blanket as a ground cloth, polypro long underwear that is fresh and dry, and the biggest fluffy socks I can find. In the summer (60 deg f +) it's a roughly 10'x16' piece of parachute cloth as a sleeping bag/blanket, the ground cloth and sleeping pad. The parachute was an accidental miracle I discovered. One layer of the giant piece keeps the bugs off, additional layers as you fold it add warmth rapidly and if need be you can put natural material between folds for additional loft that will equate to warmth. Civvy camping, I always have the parachute cloth with me, it's endlessly useful and can be used for everything from twisting it into a heavy duty rope to a windbreak. It will shed water if the angle is greater than 45degrees. The more angle, the better. Every member of a patrol should have an UNMARKED map and a compass. Yes, yes yes. If you haven't got some yet, get some clear acetate (OHP clear film!) and some permanent markers. Nail varnish remover pads for cleaning it up after use. Use map overlays if you must mark anything and make sure the overlay is not simple to determine where to put on the map to reveal its secrets. If your map guy gets blown the fuck up, well, so did the map. Everybody having a map also ensures the capability that each person can find the way home or to the objective even if they are the lone survivor. The multiple loadout issue is an easy one. Keep your bag set up as a 3-5 day but have the gear that extends the trip in a separate ditty bag that straps to the outside of the ruck or replaces your sleeping bag inside the ruck and you strap the fartsack to the outside for the longer trips. ETA- survival essentials like food and water should always be 3-5 days worth. This would perhaps be my only disagreement, but the if this is considered kept in your bergan I don't disagree. Depends if you're patrolling locally, or more of an extended clearance patrol. If I'm within an hours walk of my 'FOB' for lack of a better term, I'm not fucking carrying 3 days food for anyone. Given it takes a platoon of blokes a full day to send out patrols (in turns, naturlich) to clear that sort of area with a reasonably high level of confidence, I doubt you CAN provide much more range. And if you can't provide more range, then do you need the food? Perhaps you do, but I reckon this is going to be an AO problem, as it seems most disagreements on here are
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winter
Junior Member
Posts: 479
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Post by winter on Mar 9, 2015 19:17:25 GMT -5
Three days worth of food for me is 10 or so pieces of hardtack and a few canned meats. I also rely on foraging as resupply in the field only because I live in a place you can do that.
As my mental edible plant library grows, the more vittles for me. For a few month a yr you can simply bayonet 10-40 lb fish right out of creeks.
The old adage; "the more you know, the less you have to carry" always applies. For instance, I never carry tent pegs because I have a knife.
I forgot to add the disclaimer about AO specificity. This is my shit in Southeast Alaska, your shit should be tailored to where you are.
I will not pass up this opportunity to remind people of the importance of old school wilderness survival skills. The less you need, the better. Being able to drop your shit and run with confidence you will survive is priceless in any environment.
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Post by rmplstlskn on Mar 9, 2015 22:24:16 GMT -5
The old adage; "the more you know, the less you have to carry" always applies. For instance, I never carry tent pegs because I have a knife. The sudden flash of the OBVIOUS! This is the little tips I was talking about in planning... Why bring tent pegs when you have a knife and lots of small branches everywhere? A Duh moment... Thanks.
I have already learned quite a bit from the various posts and the experiences lived...
I have also learned that I hope I never have to do night patrols, or patrols at all... But I best have some kind of clue.
Rmpl
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winter
Junior Member
Posts: 479
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Post by winter on Mar 9, 2015 23:28:11 GMT -5
You need some idiot to go out and practice with. hahaha
You gotta have experience doing it. Knowing the rules of golf does not make a golfer.
You can test an overnight bag in the back yard. If you have kids, they can play too.
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Post by soldierofchrist on Apr 12, 2017 16:19:35 GMT -5
Here is a tip on fire starting some of you may not know, cotton and Vaseline. I tore apart some cotton balls and covered them in Vaseline and put them in an old flashlight tube. Close off both ends, attach the tube and a fire starter to my pack. A Magnesium Fire starter is the best, it will start a fire in the rain. You can buy them real cheap at Harbor Freight Tools. If you type in "free Survival Gear" you will be able to get all kinds of free gear for just the shipping charge. I have gotten Three knives and a 2,000 lumen Flashlight just for shipping. The flashlight alone sell for over a 100.00 dollars.
I have a Hammock that has a roof, with a mosquito net, I still have to spray it to make it water proof, I will us a small tarp to drop down when it rains. I have a poncho liner with a zipper with a second poncho liner inside of it, and if I need more warmth I can add a Mylar Blanket, if I put the Mylar Blanket between the two poncho liners, anyone with Night-Vision CAN NOT SEE ME. I recommend that you get several of these, I have at least 3. I will use one for my Gilly Suit, one of Sleeping, and one for emergencies. The Mylar Blankets are also called "EMERGENDY BLANKETS". You can get those for the price of shipping, around 2.00 dollars.
I also carry 500 MPH tape, a whole roll, if you cannot get it, then carry Duct Tape.
Para Cord, I carry around 500 feet.
Go to Surplus Stores and get pouches to put your stuff in. It does not have to be new stuff. I pick up a left handed Holster Rig for 30.00 dollars that would have sold new easily for over a 100.00, it even had a pouch on it. New stuff is great, but if you are on a budget, see what you can buy cheap, what you have you can use, and what you may find on sale. I need a hatched, I found two in my shed, I am cleaning them up and I will use them, the others too much. Better to have what you got, than need it and it is at home.
I bought a full Medical Kit for less than 50.00 dollars, with a quite clot sponge, everyone should have at least one quite clot sponge it your First Aid Kit. I am no Medick but in a pinch, I believe I can take care of myself.
Any Question please feel free to ask. This was in-planned and I need to get ready to go visit a friend but I will return and give you guys what is in my Assault Bag.
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